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Aristophanes
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G.W.: In "Antigone", you have given to the public an extraordinary document on your vision of the main character, and her tragic destiny. Will it be the same for "Lysistrata"? How did you conceive the main character in your latest opera?
M.Th.: For "Antigone", I have had to make a synthesis, because I wanted to put the entire Theban cycle into one work..
"Lysistrata" was simpler. No such thought process was necessary. But we may notice that every director, every author, who gets involved with Aristophanes' Greece, adds something to it, and this is possible because Aristophanes wrote a political satire, so that, every time we put "Lysistrata" on stage, we create our own satire, parallel to that of Aristophanes. This is acknowledged and allowed.
I did not do this, but added the figure of the "Poet", who does a prologue to every second or third scene, with many satirical elements. I also added other traits and characters. For example, I introduce Manos Hadjidakis and I use one of his most beautiful melodies. He too wrote a "Lysistrata" and I used this particular melody (n.b.: it is "Enan Mytho tha sas po") because I wanted to give more prominence to the lyrical side of the work, which is rarely given much importance. The comical side is insisted upon, and the lyrical, even tragic, aspect represented by this woman, is left aside.
G.W.: She fights a woman's fight…
M.Th.: Yes. In fact, Lysistrata is the incarnation of a crucial drama, as a woman, because, for centuries, women were considered as inferior to men, and, moreover, in war, the greatest victims are the women, because it is their children who are killed.
This tragic side does exist in Lysistrata. Of course, the way in which Lysistrata forces peace, that is extraordinary, a unique find. There is, in this work, much sex, much laughter, but behind the laughter, there is the whole drama of the women, more responsible than the men, and it is quite in accordance with the spirit of Aristophanes that every time his play came near entering tragedy, he would cut the atmosphere with satire and get back to comedy. It's brilliantly done, and it's what I do myself in the libretto of my opera.
G.W.: How do you see the end of the opera?
M.Th.: Everyone says that the ending of Aristophanes' comedy is a problem. For me, it's the lyric side that takes the upper hand at the end, for the reconciliation. When the women of Athens come on stage to dance and sing peace, I use Hadjidakis' music, and when the action get underway again and back to comedy, I make a great lyrical choral part.
At the end of the play, the choir plays the major role. A procession is formed. Everyone has changed clothes for the great celebration, they wear solemn costumes, the war-like costumes have disappeared, and the rhythm continues, always solemn.
First, four women protagonists come on stage - Lysistrata, Cleonica, Myirina and Lambito - one quatuor. Then the men - the Poet, Provoulos, Kinesias, the Messenger - who also sing a quatuor. Then the choirs are added, first the women, then the men. Women soloists and women's choir, men soloists and men's choir, they alternate and fuse to call for reconciliation and unity, and that is exactly what I, all my life, I have been calling out to the Greeks: "Unite!"
Aristophanes was already calling on the Greeks to be united, arguing that they have the same religion, the same language, the same breed, the same fighting spirit too, as when the take part together in the Olympic Games and fight the Persians together. Aristophanes also recalls that when the Athenians were at war with the Persians, the Spartans came to their aid…
And that is what I have been proclaiming all my life, it's my philosophy. Union of all the Greeks first, union of all the citizens of the world, of the universe, afterwards. I think that is what universal harmony is, social harmony.
Thus, at the end of his play, Aristophanes and my philosophy come together in a most extraordinary way. All the actors are on stage to proclaim that all the Greeks - Athenians, Thebans, Thessalians, Spartans, Samians, Beotians - must unite. They sing in one voice, with one heart, that finally Lysistrata's erotic army has won the war and triumphs. I have, in fact, the same finale as in "Axion Esti" or in the "Phoenicians", and also in the 4th Symphony, where the finale is also a hymn calling for union, unity, the glory of Greece.…
So I finish my musical work with a call for unity, but before that, I make a present to my friends, to the world, my personal gift: I give them, as a choir piece, the first song of "Ta Lyrika": "Tin porta anoigo to vradi", one of the most beautiful melodies I ever wrote, and I hope that through "Lysistratata", this melody may know a renewed career among opera listeners, who did not know it.
Thus, this is a personal gift, like the tribute to Hadjidakis, who was a friend and a colleague I greatly admire, because together, we worked quite a musical change in Greece. After that, I also have a melody of my brother's, because I wanted my brother to be in there too, that we might be together, as brothers, and also as artists. He is there, like a shadow of "Lipotaktes". You know my spirit, I do mystical things.
G.W.: In "Antigone", you use the "Prologue" to express your ideas about the City. In "Lysistrata", does the "Poet" fulfil the same function?
M.Th.: No, it's not like "Antigone", because the whole play goes at a terrific pace. The action has no pause, there is the constant impulse of rhythms, there are the colours, it's even the triumph of dancing and colours.
In such a context, the "Poet" provides the contrast. He sings in a lyrical way, in a very lyrical way, even if the lyrics are sometime very funny, and I picked out four or five very beautiful melodies for him. The poet is the only part who is a people's singer, laïkos,*) and if he develops his very beautiful melodies, it's because I want such melodies with a symphony orchestra..
Sometimes, inside the structure of the opera, for example with the first appearance of the old, very tired, Athenian men, coming on stage carrying fagots of wood, I have wanted to underline the "people" side, and to this end I introduce the bouzouki. I used it a second time when Provolos, the representative of the Athenians, a tenor, wants to know from Lysistrata what is happening. He come on to introduce himself, solemnly, full of self-importance, and starts to sing, but when he begins, he gets it wrong and starts to sing, in Spanish, "Vienen los Pajaros" from the "Canto General", with bouzouki accompaniment, and keeps it up for three minutes, until they tell him he's making a mistake, he's in a different play!!
Then the "Poet" comes on, but this time in the guise of the "Composer", with a huge wig, and begs pardon from the public. He takes the score, tears off a page, gives it to the orchestra, in fact, all is being prepared for a fresh musical start. but the orchestra starts to play the same music, in a different key... with another text, - this time the right one!
G.W.: You are, in effect, making fun of yourself.…
M.Th.: Yes I am. Provoulos then starts to sing, to that tune, the words of Aristophanes, saying that is the women have revolted, it is the fault of the men. He does his self-criticism. The music remains that of "Vienen los Pajaros", but entirely changed, we have different lyrics, the right ones, and here too, I use the bouzouki. And I'm using the bouzouki a third time, when Hadjidakis' song starts, and afterwards the orchestra takes over.
So, I have bouzouki and guitars, I have the popular orchestra, and all the rest is entrusted to the symphony orchestra.
G.W.: Though it is a comedy, and though you make fun of yourself, of your part, still the lyrical side takes the upper hand in the end. Thus, you stay in that "lyrical period" that has held you for fifteen years..
M.Th.: I remain completely lyrical, especially at the end, since the conclusion of the opera is the most serious, the most important thing there is:peace. You can't make a comedy of peace. And from that fact, everything becomes serious. It's like some kind of mass, of liturgy, it's a call to mankind.
Interview by Guy Wagner
English translation by Geeske Kruseman
( *) The Poet will be interpreted by George Dalaras
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